Wednesday, November 05, 2008

The Exclamation Point On The End Of The Bush Years

I'm exhausted, but extremely happy, and I'm going to bed! More tomorrow. Virginia is blue, Obama wins, Democrats make gains in the House, Senate, and governorships. We did it!!!


nicnerd said...

These are dark times, indeed. /snicker

Just kidding, I already ate my humble pie for you.

Perhaps now we may finally become privy to the substance?

Anonymous said...

I can finally see that there is a chance for this nation. I cannot understand how even the most hard hearted of the rightwingers could remain unmoved or eaten by cynicism after such a speech. Here in Orlando (on vacation from Spring,Texas. Just down the street from the ultraright sparkle)there was a huge party,and rejoicing for what has transpired.

DAVE BONES said...

Nice one. Congratulations. You ran a very polite campaign my friend.

Erik Grow said...

The substance has already been stated. The economic plan has been public for a long time.

Anon, yes, it was really amazing the outpouring. I thought it was hilarious that a big crowd gathered outside of the White House to celebrate. We brought it to their front door. Our turn.

Thank you dave bones. I did my best. I am very disillusioned with many of the people on that other blog. The hostess as well as some others really crossed a lot of lines that I would never cross. I will not be on that blog in the way I was in 2008 for 2012.

Rightwingsnarkle said...

It'll be good to listen to a president capable of speaking in complete sentences.

There'll be calls for sacrifice and effort, which will make most wingnuts howl.

That's fine - they've been relegated to the far fringes, banished for a generation or more.

Now, to work.

Tully said...

I can not tell you the relief I feel that Sen. Barack Obama was elected. Grateful that he won by a landslide as to ensure that there would be no doubt as to who was our new President Elect; no fighting over vote counts or Acorn accusations; no debating that it was too close to call and that the "liberal media elite" called it too soon. He fought for, earned, and won this election.

The media is of course focusing on the historical nature of this election - our first African American President. It is, no doubt, historical and will hopefully pave the way for racist ideologies to be challenged and put to rest once and for all. However, once the moment calms and he is in the White House governing, I hope our opponents and McCain supporters understand that we did not elect him because of his skin color or because of his race. We elected him because of who he is as a leader - not a black leader, not a white leader, but OUR leader. He won people over because of his passion, his conviction, his intelligence, his charisma, his integrity, his personal values (even if you don't agree with all his political positions), his determination, and his eloquence. He is as much white as he is black, but more importantly, he is a leader with an idealistic outlook I haven't seen in my lifetime. He is a visionary and has stood firm in his values to rise above the dirty campaign tactics and earned my respect in how he has conducted himself every step of the way.

John McCain may have served our country with pride, but he failed us in this election. He sold his soul to the GOP and let them take over his election, choose his running mate, and go dirty which he promised not to do. Is he inherently a bad leader? I don't think that's true, but even if how he ran the campaign isn't indicative of how he would have governed, the fact that he was so easily manipulated by the conservative base and the GOP just to try and win the election, manipulate the American Electorate and pander to the lowest common denominator - all that doesn't say much about his integrity, does it? It doesn't say much about his ability to run his campaign HIS WAY. It doesn't say much about his conviction to be a "Maverick" and stand up for what he believes is why should we have believed that his term in the White House would have been any different? That he would have stood up for what was right then? That he wouldn't have let the GOP manipulate him after the election to futher THEIR agenda...not his...or ours?

I feel strongly that John McCain forever tarnished his legacy! Most of us won't remember that he was a war hero, we will likely remember how he ran one of the most sad, negative, and unethical campaigns in our lifetime...and Sarah Palin can go crawl back under the rock she came from!!!

I went to bed last night feeling a lot of pride for my country, feeling hopeful for our future, and feeling safe in my home (a feeling I haven't had in quite a while). Last night didn't just feel like an election, it felt like we as a nation overthrew our corrupt government! It felt like we took back our voice as a true democracy! We reclaimed our power to say "we don't want to hear any more negative, slanderous accusations on our leader, we want solutions, and Johnny Mac, Sarah, and Joe (the Plumber)...your 15 minutes are up!" We locked horns with the traditional ideologies and institutions, not because we want conflict, but because we haven't felt heard in quite a while and want to be represented for a change. It felt like we can now reclaim our stance as a democracy that we keep trying to hold up to other nations as an example because this time, the system worked.

The last two elections were not they were surely stolen from us by the GOP machine...but we are tired, we are broke, we are sick of feeling powerless, and we want a leader who doesn't just tell us what is wrong with the world (which is all we've heard from the Republicans) we want a leader who also gives us hope that we can change it.

Never underestimate the power of hope!

Never underestimate the power that true leadership will have on a nation - a leadership that is based on inspiration, a call to action, a desire to make things better, a quest to bring people together instead of dividing the nation, and most of all, the willingness to fight for it has hard as Barack Obama has in this election. The decay of our society has been our biggest problem and has lent itself to all the issues we are confronted with now. Barack Obama won this election not because he is African American or rhetorically gifted, but because we as a people can not survive any longer without hope! We need it almost as much as we need air...and only one candidate was willing to stand up for it, risking everything, and putting his faith in the inherent decency of the American Electorate to want a nation we can ALL be proud to call home.

nicnerd said...

A landslide? I will give you decisive, even say that it was a mandate; but a landslide it was not. Six percent is not a landslide. The elections in 1984 and 1988 were our most recent landslide elections. Every race since then has been close.

Erik Grow said...

Well, H.W. Bush beat Dukakis by 7.8%. It looks like Obama's final margin will be around 6%, probably a few tenths less. Definitely decisive, and a landslide in the electoral college certainly, but probably not quite that in the popular vote, which to me is the more important measure. Mandate? I'd say reasonably so, but I really don't like that word. It's a loaded word that basically means "we don't have to listen to the opposition". I don't think Obama is going to use that like Cheney did. "2.5% mandate for Bush"... Pffft. Whatever...Dick.

I do love that Obama showed strength in EVERY area of the country. Howard Dean was actually right. We can compete everywhere. We just need the right leader and the right message. Now we need to make it do some good or it's all for nothing.

Tully said...


Well, seeing as how the popular vote has no significance at all on who becomes president (as it is more to make people feel all warm and fuzzy) and the electoral vote is currently at 349 to 163 for Obama…I’m not a mathematical wizard, but I would call that a significant landslide!!!

As for the popular vote, I would say that getting 7.4 Million more votes than your opponent is nothing to snub your nose at. The percentage gets watered down by the sheer volume of voters who turned out…but hey, whatever makes you sleep at night! ;)

nicnerd said...

Enough already, okay you win, call it a landslide if you want. I really could not give a shit. I did not vote for either of them.

Tully said...

:) Whether you realize it yet or won too. Even though you didn't vote, you still live in this country and this election will mean that things will (hopefully) get better...not just for Democrats, but for everyone!

nicnerd said...

Back up there a second. I never said that I did not vote. I personally think that any American who does not vote should be sent packing.

I said that I did not vote either of these clowns. I believe in a free America, therefore I am a Libertarian.

Rightwingsnarkle said...

I believe in a free America, therefore I am a Libertarian.


There's simply not enough time or space for the ridicule called for in that statement.

Libertarianism, the political philosophy of hunter-gatherers, and of foolish adolescents easily fooled by Ayn Rand's gibberish.

nicnerd said...

Everything but your ideology is stupid to you snarkle. You have showcased your outstanding wit so many times in the past. Had you ever shown a glimmer of intelligent discourse, I might care about your opinion.

I believe that history has proven many times over that socialism is a colossal failure. Perhaps you could enlighten my primitive minds as to why you think that the nanny government is a better model. Our choices at the moment seem to be Democrats who would attempt to collect all of your money and dole it out according to their architected social welfare system. On the other side we have the Republicans who would like to tell us that everyone must worship their God, tell people who they are permitted to love, and promote censorship.

So again, please tell me why the collective mentality is better. Try doing so without telling me to suck your cock, fuck you in the ear, eat shit. To take a page from your book, if you cannot do that, please piss off. I have had my fill of your flavor of bullshit.

Tully said...

Yikes guys!

Look, I’m learning (painfully) that if you go into these conversations with any other agenda than trying to understand where the other person is coming from, you will just frustrate yourself, end up pissed off, ruin friendships, and not walk away with any sense of satisfaction or mutual understanding.

Nicnerd…I appreciate where you are coming from. I am equally as disenchanted with the Republican Party…in your case you seem to be disenchanted with both Parties…and my hope is that Obama’s Presidency (and cabinet appointments) will at least do something to renew your faith (however small) in the fact that some people really do want to do what’s right for as many people as possible without disenfranchising folks like you. If we haven’t earned that thus far, then we have work to do in order to win you over.

We don’t all have to agree…in fact, it is through disagreement that we usually find the most innovative and progressive solutions. The trick is to disagree without being disagreeable. ;)

nicnerd said...

I agree with you Tully. I am not one of these bitter people that shun the new President-elect. I give him full confidence to see where he goes. I prefer not to point fingers and hurl insults, I only want to know why this collective nanny mentality is good. Why should the government be so involved in everything that we do? There are very few things that necessitate a central organization to look after.

Tully said...

Well…I don’t think a collective nanny mentality is good, nor do I think we should give people a pass and not hold them accountable for not being willing to help themselves. That group exists (shamefully) and it ticks me off.

However, there is a larger group of human beings that are falling on hard times as a result of a poor economy, lay off’s, etc. that just need a little help to keep from losing their house, or keep food on the table, or put gas in their car so that they can get to work. The bulk of that help will come in the form of a tax cut for those who ARE working – and if we weren’t in such a deficit perhaps the ├╝ber rich wouldn’t even have to pay more taxes…but the money has to come from somewhere to dig us out of this hole or things will just get worse, and worse, and worse.

The government (in its ideal state) is supposed to represent us as a nation and fight the battles we can’t fight for ourselves. The ideal has been perverted and manipulated by corruption and greed – and perhaps that is why the status quo did not get elected this time…we are sick of it.

One of the things I like most about Obama’s ideology is that he seems to stand firm that we must abandon that victim mentality and get off our duff! The government can help you, but it won’t carry you. If we can inspire people to act on their own, use the aide as a tool to boost themselves out of the hole, but do the rest of the climbing on their own…if we all did that, then can we agree that the world would be better for it?

I don’t agree with handouts for the listless and complacent…but I support helping smart kids who don’t have the money go to school. I support helping seniors who can’t take care of themselves any longer (as we will all be that old someday). I support that single parent who didn’t plan on being divorced or widowed needing just a little help to get a job or buy a safe home for their children.

We were not put on this planet to live in isolation from one another, we need each other – if for no other reason than to feel connected to something bigger than ourselves. What you call a nanny mentality I just see as our chance to make a difference in someone’s life – and that someone could someday end up taking that boost, going to an Ivy League school through his/her own merit, end up being profoundly impacted by the services that enabled him/her to achieve success, and end up inspiring others to do the same for someone else. He might even end up as President of the United States! ;)

BTW, I love this clip:

nicnerd said...

Interesting, I appreciate your views. I am not inclined to agree, but I understand the sentiment.

My position is that this sort of help need not be mandated by the government. The desire to help your fellow man is ingrained in everyone. I volunteer my time as a firefighter; not because Uncle Sam thinks I should, but because I want to help. I did Big Brothers because it was enriching to me and the kids I met. I go and help people in Appalachia fix up their houses. I am not tooting my own horn, but the government need not tell teach me the golden rule.

Serious question, do you think if the government did not provide for basic welfare; that everyday people would not just step up of their own volition?

I have needed a hand in the past, and people have been there for me. I feel like I am just paying it forward, as I think many people do.

Tully said...

I think we are likely of like minds on welfare. I support Obama’s desire to give a tax break to those who are WORKING…I hate the welfare system and wish that we would limit how long people could abuse it.

Yes, I do think people would step up on their own…as they would have no other choice! It’s a flawed system, for sure, and lazy people will milk it as long as they can.

Not just welfare, but I have a friend of mine whose husband lost his job back in the summer. He knew a month in advance that it was coming, but didn’t even have his resume put together!!?!! Then when the big day came, he was angry (almost even surprised…uhm, hello). No degree and not a ton of high end experience in a crappy job market…means that his choices are limited to entry level IT jobs, but instead of taking that and working his way back up (because ANY job is better than NO job), he turned his nose up at it, saying the job was “beneath him” and to this day remains unemployed. Meanwhile she is working her ass off and stressed because they are running out of money. So…I asked her yesterday, “What the hell would he do if he was single?” She never responded!

That kind of complacency and sense of entitlement is EXACTLY the sort of thing I despise…whether it’s folks living perpetually off of welfare or losers who sponge off their wives (and sadly, I know more than one).

But, some programs actually just bridge the gap people need to get on their feet…when they are really interested in being self sufficient…and those programs need to stick around. ;)

nicnerd said...

I like they way you think on that Tully. I would dig ditches if it was the bringing home food for my kids.

Now this is extreme, but I have to say hunger is one heck of a motivator. I read about the Great Depression and how people would beg for work and do anything to feed their families. I think that we lack that level of motivation these days because we know that the government will take care of us.

It makes me think of the old quote, "the government cannot give what it does not first take away".

I know that I never would take public money, even if I did qualify. I would rather die, than subsist on a handout.

Rightwingsnarkle said...

I know that I never would take public money, even if I did qualify. I would rather die, than subsist on a handout.

Promises, promises.

Tully said...

I agree that hunger or homelessness is probably the only thing that will wake “some people” up.

I will say that many people (myself included, and probably many people who post on Erik’s blog) don’t have to hit that point before we do something.

For me it’s a pride issue – not pride because of what someone might think of me, but pride in the sense that as long as I’m able bodied and have a mind that is strong, I need to be taking care of myself. I’m also faced with what unpreparedness can do to a elderly mother lives with me because she was a stay at home Mom most of her life and then when my parents divorced (no degree) she had to take whatever job she could get – clearly barely making enough to support two kids much less save for retirement. My dad was kind of a deadbeat (Erik’s heard enough stories, I won’t elaborate), but at one point things got so bad, that we were growing our own food in our beautiful 1 acre Alabama garden…but we never went on public assistance. I worked at 16, my sister quit school, moved home and worked, and my Mom worked 2 jobs…we managed! So, I have a hard time understanding how some people can live with themselves when they aren’t doing anything to “help themselves!”

There are some programs out there, though, that do more than just give handouts: Scholarship programs, Habitat for Humanity, etc….all just give people a boost – what they do with that afterwards is up to them. ;)

Tully said...

BTW, on a completely unrelated topic...I love Michelle Obama, but what was that dress all about???

Rightwingsnarkle said...

Well, Tully, weren't you lucky to have that 'beautiful' acre to grow yer stuff on.

So I suppose anybody who doesn't have an acre of land is just too lazy to get one?

As for your comment that hunger or homelessness is probably the only thing that will wake “some people” up. I'm curious if by 'some people' you actually mean 'niggers;' and if you've ever considered that hunger or homelessness (or maybe some combination of the two) might just beat 'some people' down before it wakes them up.

I dunno. My belly's never been empty for long, thank god. And I've been lucky enough to always have a pretty decent roof over my head.

Everybody else should be so fortunate.

Erik Grow said...

Snark, Tully is a friend and co-worker of mine, and I can assure you that her meaning was not racial, though she can and I'm sure will speak for herself. In fact, she has a friend that is quite a deadbeat who we have discussed before, and he is as white as me, which is pretty white. Heh. I won't go into more detail on that because I don't have permission to re-tell the story, but it's kind of funny and it's an object lesson in just the kind of thing we're talking about.

Rightwingsnarkle said...

Tully, being embarrassed for yourself should keep you plenty occupied, and probably sucks up pretty much all of your available embarrassment.

And please spare me your pearl-clutching offense at my language. That's just a cheap and lazy way to avoid the issue.

Who exactly were you slagging in your reference to "some people?" Italians? Jews? Hairlips? Short people? Your in-laws?

As for your little 'lazy schmuck' anecdote, I imagine we can all conjure up a story about somebody we believe is a worthless dickhead.

As far as they go, they're still just stories, and they say as much, or more, about the teller than they do about the subject.

But as data upon which to base a discussion about social problems, and about policy? Pure bullshit.

tully said...

Snarkle…you’re a moron…as evidenced by your posts. I don’t know you any more than you (seem to think) know me…but I do visualize a fat, middle-aged, bald guy with glasses who lives in his mothers basement and is infatuated with snakes and lizards! You probably are cut from the same cloth as the likes of Ted Kaczynski – socially retarded (which has clearly been displayed here) and unable to see anything good in the world. I would imagine that the only social interaction you get is through the Internet or work, because if you have ever displayed THIS personality to someone in real life, you would likely be branded as “Milton” from Office Space.

I checked out your sad little blog! Nothing but piss and vinegar! Either you are an incredibly miserable person or you just get off on trying to make other people miserable. Either way, you aren’t worth the time I’m taking to even write his, so it will be the last time that I respond to any of your hate provoking statements.

So, run along and go look for your red stapler!

Rightwingsnarkle said...

Looks like "some people" get very pissy very easily.